3 Horses Per Race

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Dylan Christensen
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Re: 3 Horses Per Race

Post by Dylan Christensen »

Emmie Kay wrote: 4 years ago
Dylan Christensen wrote: 4 years ago
Danny Derby wrote: 4 years ago Any chance of upping it to 4 for the Derby?
I don’t think there should be any limit for these and especially not the Derby, if you have a horse with enough points to make it into the meat of the field than it 1000% should be running.
With no limits at all, couldn’t this also mean that horses with similar points/abilities get pushed out if one owner, who has a handful of qualifying horses, enters all theirs at the exact second the race opens? Then what would be the solution for such an instance? Yes I know, hypothetically improbable. Still something I’d consider.
The odds of the worst horses having the same exact amount of points is so slim I don’t think it would ever happen
yeah
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Dave Trainer
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Re: 3 Horses Per Race

Post by Dave Trainer »

Its easily possible for a very sound horse to have more points than a far superior unsound horse because it would have had more runs. So the argument about the best horses being in the race isn't valid.

I don't want to see a derby, or any big race, where all 16 horses are only owned by 4 players. 3 per race is enough.
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Rochelle Bos
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Re: 3 Horses Per Race

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I never thought I’d agree with Dave, but here we are.

I was coming here to say just that. Having a race where it’s possible for 4 people own all the horses, there is no fun in that.

I also don’t understand why anyone would want to set up 1-4 horses to lose?
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Carole Hanson
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Re: 3 Horses Per Race

Post by Carole Hanson »

Not that it changes the argument much but the Derby has a max field of 20 rather than 16
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Dylan Christensen
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Re: 3 Horses Per Race

Post by Dylan Christensen »

Dave Trainer wrote: 4 years ago Its easily possible for a very sound horse to have more points than a far superior unsound horse because it would have had more runs. So the argument about the best horses being in the race isn't valid.

I don't want to see a derby, or any big race, where all 16 horses are only owned by 4 players. 3 per race is enough.
That’s true but it does work this way in real life too, which is where I was coming from. The more I think about it, i think, to have unlimited entries I think you would have to have Derby trail specific points that are different from normal races meaning Grade is not the only deciding factor in point values, purse is as well, similar to the real Derby. But I still back the idea of 4 horses in a race. Especially when you have people with 4 deserving horses, does that mean some trainee might get shut out in their first chance? Possible, but it’s very unlikely that horse would have won anyways.
yeah
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Danny Derby
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Re: 3 Horses Per Race

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Rochelle Zahacy wrote: 4 years ago I never thought I’d agree with Dave, but here we are.

I was coming here to say just that. Having a race where it’s possible for 4 people own all the horses, there is no fun in that.

I also don’t understand why anyone would want to set up 1-4 horses to lose?
Because it’s the Derby. I’d gladly let 3 horses finish 18th-20th if I also had the winner.

If the top 20 3-year-olds by some chance happen to be owned by only four people then those are the only four people that should be running in the Derby that year. This is an extreme example of course, but I think it’s wrong that any contender with enough points be barred from running just because their trainer has other legit contenders as well.
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Re: 3 Horses Per Race

Post by Lee Tuttle »

Having more than 2 in a race based on points for age restricted is reasonable.
But having the same rule for older open graded stakes is not. Crappy past their peak cheap claimers can be put into these races to fill slots so your competition has less of a chance to enter a strong horse that has an equal or greater chance to beat you. Two entries is enough for those races.
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Danny Derby
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Re: 3 Horses Per Race

Post by Danny Derby »

Here's a hot take. Why limit field size at all? It's a thing in real life because of the size of the track and the starting gate. This is the SIM world. If someone wants to enter a horse in a race, there's no reason to impose an arbitrary limit.
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Dylan Christensen
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Re: 3 Horses Per Race

Post by Dylan Christensen »

Danny Derby wrote: 4 years ago
Rochelle Zahacy wrote: 4 years ago I never thought I’d agree with Dave, but here we are.

I was coming here to say just that. Having a race where it’s possible for 4 people own all the horses, there is no fun in that.

I also don’t understand why anyone would want to set up 1-4 horses to lose?
Because it’s the Derby. I’d gladly let 3 horses finish 18th-20th if I also had the winner.

If the top 20 3-year-olds by some chance happen to be owned by only four people then those are the only four people that should be running in the Derby that year. This is an extreme example of course, but I think it’s wrong that any contender with enough points be barred from running just because their trainer has other legit contenders as well.
100% agree
yeah
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Dylan Christensen
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Re: 3 Horses Per Race

Post by Dylan Christensen »

Lee Tuttle wrote: 4 years ago Having more than 2 in a race based on points for age restricted is reasonable.
But having the same rule for older open graded stakes is not. Crappy past their peak cheap claimers can be put into these races to fill slots so your competition has less of a chance to enter a strong horse that has an equal or greater chance to beat you. Two entries is enough for those races.
Change it to be based off points earned that year, simple fix
yeah
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Dylan Christensen
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Re: 3 Horses Per Race

Post by Dylan Christensen »

Danny Derby wrote: 4 years ago Here's a hot take. Why limit field size at all? It's a thing in real life because of the size of the track and the starting gate. This is the SIM world. If someone wants to enter a horse in a race, there's no reason to impose an arbitrary limit.
This I don’t agree with, this would completely throw out the idea of mirroring real life and would cause some absurd entries.
yeah
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Danny Derby
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Re: 3 Horses Per Race

Post by Danny Derby »

Dylan Christensen wrote: 4 years ago
Danny Derby wrote: 4 years ago Here's a hot take. Why limit field size at all? It's a thing in real life because of the size of the track and the starting gate. This is the SIM world. If someone wants to enter a horse in a race, there's no reason to impose an arbitrary limit.
This I don’t agree with, this would completely throw out the idea of mirroring real life and would cause some absurd entries.
Do this for stakes races only. Look at racing in Australia and Europe, you've got races with close to 30 runners there.
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Re: 3 Horses Per Race

Post by LA Pepper »

Seems to me points should only be used in "same age" races. Otherwise an older horse in the stakes division could accumulate a lot of points but be seriously in the twilight of its career, but still bump out an up and coming younger horse with gobs of potential.
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Dave Trainer
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Re: 3 Horses Per Race

Post by Dave Trainer »

Danny Derby wrote: 4 years ago
Rochelle Zahacy wrote: 4 years ago I never thought I’d agree with Dave, but here we are.

I was coming here to say just that. Having a race where it’s possible for 4 people own all the horses, there is no fun in that.

I also don’t understand why anyone would want to set up 1-4 horses to lose?
Because it’s the Derby. I’d gladly let 3 horses finish 18th-20th if I also had the winner.

If the top 20 3-year-olds by some chance happen to be owned by only four people then those are the only four people that should be running in the Derby that year. This is an extreme example of course, but I think it’s wrong that any contender with enough points be barred from running just because their trainer has other legit contenders as well.
Taken to its logical conclusion then, if the top 20 3 year olds were all owned by one person by some chance then they should have the race to themselves.
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Danny Derby
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Re: 3 Horses Per Race

Post by Danny Derby »

Dave Trainer wrote: 4 years ago
Danny Derby wrote: 4 years ago
Rochelle Zahacy wrote: 4 years ago I never thought I’d agree with Dave, but here we are.

I was coming here to say just that. Having a race where it’s possible for 4 people own all the horses, there is no fun in that.

I also don’t understand why anyone would want to set up 1-4 horses to lose?
Because it’s the Derby. I’d gladly let 3 horses finish 18th-20th if I also had the winner.

If the top 20 3-year-olds by some chance happen to be owned by only four people then those are the only four people that should be running in the Derby that year. This is an extreme example of course, but I think it’s wrong that any contender with enough points be barred from running just because their trainer has other legit contenders as well.
Taken to its logical conclusion then, if the top 20 3 year olds were all owned by one person by some chance then they should have the race to themselves.
Correct, and they should probably also be inducted into the Hall of Fame at the same time for managing that.
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