Total Purses in the SIM

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George Knatz
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Re: Total Purses in the SIM

Post by George Knatz » 3 months ago

Dave Trainer wrote:
3 months ago
Because Emily wants to take money out of the game. This has been said quit e a lot during this thread.
Ahhh fantastic reason. :roll: I guess she’ll figure it out then.

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The Admin
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Re: Total Purses in the SIM

Post by The Admin » 3 months ago

Total Purses in the SIM - wow, that is the longest thread I have ever paid attention to. And it is the longest where people have stayed fairly civil. Awesome!

A number of times, people said stuff like “management wants to take money out of the game. I don’t know why”. My answer would be, management always wants the game to be enjoyable to play - or worth playing. It has to be challenging, but provide successes for everyone. No matter what people might say, they don’t want to win 100% of the time and don’t want unlimited money.

The SIM economy is whack because it is pretend. Something is unrealistic if a horse trainer can amass $110,000,000+. We (I) don’t care if some players have 100x more money than someone else - that is real. But, is the game as fun as it could be for someone who has $100mil? Is some of the challenge gone? And, if a lot of players have tens of millions of dollars, is it possible for a poorer player to ever get a good horse? Maybe? The caps were designed to help with that.

I think it’s funny that we talk about purses being “slashed” but the numbers don’t show it. It almost seems like the purses that were increased made up for the reductions.

Some of the suggestions are clever but address the issue in a backwards way. A huge source invented money is the purses. Does it really make sense to keep purses high, but to impose fees directly related to those purses? That is exactly the same as reducing the purses.

Taxing your bank balance doesn't make sense. Should someone with $100mil in cash be taxed, but someone with $10,000 in cash, and a million horses not taxed?

Betting was partially designed to get money out of the game. The house takes a cut. But, we have minimum win amounts which can create money, and the starting pools is invented money.

We added some big ticket items like farms (any others for SIM$?) That helps. And the ongoing fees help. Can we think of more big ticket SIM$ things that only rich people can afford? Something that doesn’t give them a big advantage, but just prestige or notoriety. Rich people may be willing to do that. We could add in-SIM humanitarian causes. Maybe a version of sponsoring a race that only costs SIM$ or less GPs where the purse money comes from the sponsor?

Perhaps a graduated day-rate based on the number of horses you have? Increasing the farm recurring fees? Something costs you more unless you donate bunches of money to a pretend SIM cause (build a better pool for the AJ horses?)

The better a horse is (lifetime earnings including breeding?), the more things cost for that horse because they get better stalls and more expensive food.?

I am brainstorming about ways to have people use their money without taxing.

As always, adjustments and enhancements to the SIM are always motivated and informed by trying to increase player's enjoyment of the game. Even Game Points, which brings real money into the SIM, benefit the game because it funds the infrastructure and innovation of the SIM, which helps ensure its long-term existence.

Thanks for your support of SimHorseRacing.com!

Mark Markson
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Re: Total Purses in the SIM

Post by Mark Markson » 3 months ago

Stormy Peak wrote:
3 months ago
Just create a Sim Church, and once a week a donation tray pops up... people can donate or not and what's in the tray gets burned to celebrate Festivus --- poof the money's gone. Maybe too even crown the biggest donator as Festivus King or Queen :P

If that doesn't work...then start talking about taxes. lol (yep, I said this after 14 pages have been produced on the subject...lol)

Stormy
There's a few lol's in there, so I'm not sure if you're joking, or if you are laughing at how ridiculous it is that it took 14 pages of postings before someone mentioned the concept of voluntary donations, but it's the first idea I've seen that I agree with 100%. Honestly, some seem a little too excited in this thread to develop ways to reach into someone else's pocket and take away their hard-earned Sim money. While it's great seeing debate raging on ways to make the simconomy closer to what the Steward is looking for, few of these ideas have been about impacting all players equally. Instead I've mostly seen Simsters trying to devise ways to hit the big barns and make them pay the bulk of the way. That just doesn't pass the smell test to me; guess I just don't believe in punishing players who have put in the hard work over multiple real-life years. Besides, there are so many different, valid, fun ways to play this Sim, no proposed idea I've seen would impact all playing styles to the same degree.

This is only my second season so for all I know the volunteer thing has been tried (and Stormy is lol-ing because it didn't go well?). But it seems to me before we force payments on some/all (disproportionately affecting the big barns), or make the game more Sim-expensive to play (disproportionately affecting the smaller barns who then wouldn't have the same ease of access to valuable information), why not give players a chance to donate to a Save-our-Sim program maybe once a season or year? Show progress against the current goal ($300M?), and publish the percent of barns that have donated above a certain percentage of their bankrolls. Don't name names because it's truly voluntary, but see how the community responds overall and let players put their Sim money where their Sim mouths are. At the end of the donation drive see where we are and go from there. Would everyone donate? Heck no they wouldn't and yes, that's a potential issue. Non-donator types always exist (just as some would undoubtedly find some way to cheat around paying taxes), but at least we'd have a baseline. I guess in the end I vote we give the players a chance to re-calibrate the game voluntarily before forcing unpopular or inconsistent game changes on all.

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Glenn Escobar
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Re: Total Purses in the SIM

Post by Glenn Escobar » 3 months ago

Well Tim, go ahead and argue with THE ADMIN. Because he isn’t in favor of any tax structure.

Have fun attacking him and his basic ideas in regard to the SIM Economy.

He literally said “taxing your bank balance doesn’t make sense”. So you’ve lost the tax debate, amigo.


He’s not going to tax you or anyone else. Ever. So you can go on and on about how everyone wants to be taxed, but the person who would enable the coding doesn’t want to tax you. Please, by all means attack him like you do everyone else in this thread.
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The Admin
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Re: Total Purses in the SIM

Post by The Admin » 3 months ago

Glenn Escobar wrote:
3 months ago
Well Tim, go ahead and argue with THE ADMIN. Because he isn’t in favor of any tax structure.

Have fun attacking him and his basic ideas in regard to the SIM Economy.

He literally said “taxing your bank balance doesn’t make sense”. So you’ve lost the tax debate, amigo.


He’s not going to tax you or anyone else. Ever. So you can go on and on about how everyone wants to be taxed, but the person who would enable the coding doesn’t want to tax you. Please, by all means attack him like you do everyone else in this thread.
I don't really understand this post.

We are always looking for ways to improve the SIM. We are focusing on finances at the moment. If there is a money build up, it is either because we inject too much money in (the solution to which is to inject less), or that there are not enough ways to spend that money (the solution is to increase costs or create new reasons to spend your money).

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Cleo Patra
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Re: Total Purses in the SIM

Post by Cleo Patra » 3 months ago

Maybe stallion sponsorship of races? Like the Conquerer at Stud Maiden and then a banner on the race page or something. Sponsor 10 races for 500k or some such?
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George Knatz
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Re: Total Purses in the SIM

Post by George Knatz » 3 months ago

I think there are a lot of things that could be added to barns. Special items that add 1% or 10% extra rest that cost 10 or 15 million dollars so every farm doesn’t have one. The percentage could decrease yearly so farm owners would have to renew after x number of years.

I don’t know about everyone else but I ship my horses to either my farm or the closest farm to where I need to be. I don’t look at the farm because they are all the same. With items like that I would look at farms much closer. Farm owners would get increased revenue to help defer the cost and of course the boost would help their own horses.

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Re: Total Purses in the SIM

Post by The Steward » 3 months ago

Cleo Patra wrote:
3 months ago
Maybe stallion sponsorship of races? Like the Conquerer at Stud Maiden and then a banner on the race page or something. Sponsor 10 races for 500k or some such?
Maybe stallions should sponsor races for their offspring only, which will cost more than the purse of the race, obviously... but could bump up the stats and make the stallions look more attractive, especially if the owner guarantees to keep sponsoring races for those offspring...
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Glenn Escobar
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Re: Total Purses in the SIM

Post by Glenn Escobar » 3 months ago

The Admin wrote:
3 months ago
Glenn Escobar wrote:
3 months ago
Well Tim, go ahead and argue with THE ADMIN. Because he isn’t in favor of any tax structure.

Have fun attacking him and his basic ideas in regard to the SIM Economy.

He literally said “taxing your bank balance doesn’t make sense”. So you’ve lost the tax debate, amigo.


He’s not going to tax you or anyone else. Ever. So you can go on and on about how everyone wants to be taxed, but the person who would enable the coding doesn’t want to tax you. Please, by all means attack him like you do everyone else in this thread.
I don't really understand this post.

We are always looking for ways to improve the SIM. We are focusing on finances at the moment. If there is a money build up, it is either because we inject too much money in (the solution to which is to inject less), or that there are not enough ways to spend that money (the solution is to increase costs or create new reasons to spend your money).
I’m just saying that taxes clearly aren’t the answer. Just like your post above said. Tim Matthews in particular had decided that taxes were for sure the answer and he had his plan.

I’m saying that based on what you said, and frankly just based on common sense in general, the SIM isn’t going to tax players so he doesn’t need to shout down players who are against a tax.
“In the race for excellence,there is no finish line.”

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The Steward
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Re: Total Purses in the SIM

Post by The Steward » 3 months ago

George Knatz wrote:
3 months ago
I think there are a lot of things that could be added to barns. Special items that add 1% or 10% extra rest that cost 10 or 15 million dollars so every farm doesn’t have one. The percentage could decrease yearly so farm owners would have to renew after x number of years.
LOVE ideas like this.
"There's no secret to training a good horse. It's a matter of being fortunate enough to get one."
"Funny how you often regret the stuff you didn't do more than the stuff you did do" - GG

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Cleo Patra
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Re: Total Purses in the SIM

Post by Cleo Patra » 3 months ago

The Steward wrote:
3 months ago
Cleo Patra wrote:
3 months ago
Maybe stallion sponsorship of races? Like the Conquerer at Stud Maiden and then a banner on the race page or something. Sponsor 10 races for 500k or some such?
Maybe stallions should sponsor races for their offspring only, which will cost more than the purse of the race, obviously... but could bump up the stats and make the stallions look more attractive, especially if the owner guarantees to keep sponsoring races for those offspring...
I’d probably do that for my guys. It’s so tricky to keep their names in people’s minds!
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Rochelle Zahacy
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Re: Total Purses in the SIM

Post by Rochelle Zahacy » 3 months ago

Stormy Peak wrote:
3 months ago
Just create a Sim Church, and once a week a donation tray pops up... people can donate or not and what's in the tray gets burned to celebrate Festivus --- poof the money's gone. Maybe too even crown the biggest donator as Festivus King or Queen :P

If that doesn't work...then start talking about taxes. lol (yep, I said this after 14 pages have been produced on the subject...lol)

Stormy
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George Knatz
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Re: Total Purses in the SIM

Post by George Knatz » 3 months ago

How about a nice size fee after gallops that allows you to run your horse an extra race a year. Unsounds could run 7 sounds 8 and very sounds 9. I’d pay a fee (depends how much) for my stakes gallopers to get an extra race.

I can come up with a hundred ways to charge money! Lol

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The Admin
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Re: Total Purses in the SIM

Post by The Admin » 3 months ago

Glenn Escobar wrote:
3 months ago
I’m just saying that taxes clearly aren’t the answer. Just like your post above said. Tim Matthews in particular had decided that taxes were for sure the answer and he had his plan.

I’m saying that based on what you said, and frankly just based on common sense in general, the SIM isn’t going to tax players so he doesn’t need to shout down players who are against a tax.
I have appreciated all the posts including the pro-taxes ones. I hope that no player feels shut down. This thread has really helped me think it through. I was pro-tax before I started thinking about all the aspects of it.

We'll figure something good out.

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Cleo Patra
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Re: Total Purses in the SIM

Post by Cleo Patra » 3 months ago

I think we should have unicorn racing where you pay 2 million to have a racing unicorn in their own little circuit and they win rainbow dust. If you win enough rainbow dust, you can sprinkle it on a foal and they’ll stay mature for one extra season or be guaranteed to only need one piece of equipment or something. It’s fun and cute and doesn’t give massive tangible benefits but it is novel enough to actually splurge money on.
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Turf Routers... TIME LIMIT | OBSIDIAN FURY

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