Flash Q

[Marzy Dotes]

I didn't take it that way as to how it started though this is the second thread I've read about it in the mixers forum. I think the issues are great for discussion and there's been great input on them in general but when it turns into a discussion about one specific person being "ignorant" basically and complaining about what they're doing or not doing, that's when it becomes problematic in my opinion. That's happened before and I don't think I really have reached the point personally where it still doesn't bother me still. Maybe it's just me that feels that way but I am who I am and that's just fine with me.

That said, I really like and agree with Laura's post. I wish I could say the same thing as clearly and as well as she did. Stuff happens and you adapt to it and move on. It all works out in interesting and rewarding ways, for a lot of us it's the challenges of trying to figure out how to do the best we can to achieve our goals that makes it worthwhile. Someone brought up Sunny Attitude and yeah, the gelding hit me hard too. Though I didn't really realize how much it did until I raced and am now breeding his daughter. But no matter what I feel, it's his owner's decision to do what he wants with his horse in any case and life goes on...The Sim continues, the bloodlines continue perhaps in different but no less exciting directions. That's why I don't stress about it much. It's a guarantee that it's going to bigger and better places...certainly in mixers.

Congratulations for this player for such a good purchase (and I certainly wasn't that savvy when I was new!) and taking advantage of a valuable resource! More power to them! Yeah it's unfortunate that the stud can't stand but that's not a bad rule in my opinion at all. I think it's there for a good reason. I wish her the best of luck with her stable and have fun while you're here! That goes for everyone by the way.

[Brandon Cashell]

It is really frustrating because as Kay pointed out the QHs can't afford to lose Flash Q and Sunny Attitude before their time is up. The breed is still young and really needs bloodlines without Goldmine in them. It's just a shame many people, myself included, have made offers with packages of yearlings, racing stock, and money and haven't even gotten a response. If a new player can't stand a stud the why can they buy them? What's the point in that?

[Bryan Doolittle]

Are we looking at a rule that limits how good of a male horse a new player can get? I can say that if I didn’t get Automobile from the new player page, I probably wouldn’t be playing (and paying) here 4 ½ years later. Getting a good horse is the most important thing as a new player. If they choose to pass on an opportunity to pick up some money, it is on them. It is the players’ choice of how they want to handle their horses. I’m sure that anyone of us can have our stable looked through and critiqued by other players

If Flash Q wasn’t 13 years old, then I might be more bothered by this. He was at stud for 8 seasons. Veteran QH breeders didn’t exactly miss the opportunity. For new players that didn’t get a chance to breed to him, Flash Fast (no Goldmine in pedigree) is due to retire at the end of this season. And Flash Fast is faster than dad. Older pedigrees that go well with Goldmine mares would include Seeing Ghosts Q, Piecemaker, Six Fortunes, Jack and Coke, and Special Effect.


Maybe the player is a little intimidated by the large amounts of e-mail they have received regarding Flash Q? Maybe English isn’t their first language? Maybe this is Messi throwing a monkey wrench in? It could be any number of reasons but I don’t think we need to change the rules

The bigger questions is~ Why am I writing a three paragraph response to a three page thread regarding a 13 year old stallion that was used nine times by five players through ten weeks last season?

[Marzy Dotes]

Eh...it's still a short short compared to what I usually write. But I think you raised some good points about breeding middle distance runners and you got me thinking about that a bit.

Flash Q in his seasons was pretty underused compared to some of the other major players like Goldmine, Kings, Piecemaker and even My Midas Touch. Likely because those two overshadowed most everyone else but as they get older they will and have sons to replace them. Wow Factor is one example. Golden Blinker another. So you have other lines going back to these foundational sires and others. But as we saw sometimes you can have or threaten to have too much of a good thing, i.e. proliferation or dominance of certain studs in the bloodline pool. That makes it more challenging and sometimes tricky, involving planning a generation or so ahead so you don't dead end out. But it provides plenty of opportunities as well.

I love Sunny Attitude to bits even without his bits. I think he was probably as a foundational sire one of the best or perhaps the best of all because he was so versatile. Maybe less than 200 foals but his influence is everywhere! He's got some very nice sons like Black Wolf who was responsible for a large part of the most recent evolution of routing for example. Injecting his speed (which I think is one reason for his versatility on top of no real parents) into the stamina influences there either through himself or Black Wolf, i.e. Midnight Ride anyone? Deroyal Point's son Deroyal Mood anyone, with some Sunny Attitude on the female side? The routing division recently has gone Kaboom and the addition of Sunny Attitude lines is a major reason why.

On the filly's side, they are probably as golden as you get. And a lot of people know that. I feel fortunate to have one of them myself when I bred him to a Dbacks mare after doing some research on him and saw how good Black Wolf was on the racetrack. And it worked out fine though I found out she was somewhat speedier than her half brother who was by Driven Dashin, one of the top foundational sires on the stamina side. She raced quite well and nicks very well with router sires. "A" nicks in routing aren't too uncommon with Sunny Attitude's daughters. And with endurance studs like Driven Dashin. Va-voom! His youngster who won a SC race last year was out of a Sunny Attitude mare.

Due to his pensioning, there's a finite number of them on the canvas and they rarely get AJed or put up for sale b/c most people know what they've got. If Sunny Attitude hadn't been pensioned there likely would have been much more progeny by him mostly female. The impact of that we can only guess, would it have been a good thing or too much of a good thing? We'll never really know the answer to that. The only thing that can be done is to work with the influence that he got started in the different subdivisions and just move on.

And before I ramble on too much further, I'd just like to bring up another sire not mentioned so far that might turn out to be an important resource and that's Ok Ok another sire that shares some of Sunny Attitude's versatility though not quite as fast perhaps. At only $5k a pop, he's certainly worth producing future broodmares. I bred a couple of them including a wow yearling and a filly I retired and has two foals and I'm having a grand old time trying to breed around Goldmine for just a while.

This is probably way off topic by now because I barely mentioned Flash Q and [fire and brimstone] I've had fun with this so maybe I'll just start a thread on the breeding but some of the posts on the bloodlines have given me food for thought.

Thanks for reading!

[Brandon Cashell]

Another one Marzy is OK OK'a son Spanish Okie he looks like he can sire horses from sprinters to routers so far, i actually like him more than Ok OK.
I get your points Brian and i guess there is really nothing that can be done. I was only saying thay it might make senses to allow jew players to be studs, but i guess that would sort of a slippery slope, oh well it is what it is at this point.

[Kay O. Johnson]

New players should be able to get male racers because they are able to race them, conversely they should not be able to buy stallions because they can not stand them. I think Bryans point is not valid.
Also the point that Flash Q has sons standing is irrelevant-his sons might not be free of Goldmine which is very important also they may not be as good of a sire as Flash Q.
Sadly the third point is also irrelevant that he was only used 9 times by week 10. I and I suspect several others do not breed any foals before week 10.

[Kay O. Johnson]

Also all the horses you mentioned that cross well with Goldmine are very near pensioning themselves which is why it is even more important to get Flash Q back. Bryan you really should do better research before posting.

[Bryan Doolittle]

“Also the point that Flash Q has sons standing is irrelevant-his sons might not be free of Goldmine which is very important also they may not be as good of a sire as Flash Q.”

Note that the son of Flash Q which I mentioned IS free of Goldmine. (You should read the actual post before responding to it.)

“Sadly the third point is also irrelevant that he was only used 9 times by week 10. I and I suspect several others do not breed any foals before week 10.”

Flash Q being used 9 times in 10 weeks is a fact. When anyone choose to breed to a horse that is 12 years old at the time is irrelevant (to me).

“Also all the horses you mentioned that cross well with Goldmine are very near pensioning themselves which is why it is even more important to get Flash Q back”

All of the horses that I mentioned that go well with Goldmine were BECAUSE they are close to pensioning.

I give up, you're right, losing the “great” Flash Q (39% winners-enough research?) as a sire is the first sign of tomorrow’s apocalypse. Mid distance racing is sure to crumble without him.