Help With My Impulse Buy

Lisa Strummer · Post by **Lisa Strummer** » 17 years ago

On an impulse, I bought a cheap Anthem mare-<a href='http://www.simhorseracing.com/horse.php?HorseID=17772' target='_blank'>Troopingthecolour </a> I'm not sure I'll breed her this year, but I really like Anthem and she's out of an Unbridled's Song mare so I went ahead and bought her. I have been going through various sires and have picked a few:
Always Will
Tribal Rule
Standard
Yamikishi
Shield
Standard
and possibly Strongerable
I am still researching, and don't know if I should stick to a pure sprinter sire or maybe go with a miler. And the inbreeding, I haven't decided either, so I was hoping for any advice...

Jonathan Bolt · Post by **Jonathan Bolt** » 17 years ago

Did you check out Always Will

Laura Ferguson · Post by **Laura Ferguson** » 17 years ago

At least, if you're going to try breeding, you're not spending a ton, and you're asking for advice, so it isn't a bad way to go.

Way back when, I was a poor, new SIM player, and I actually owned Hip Hop at one point. The mare had more turf influences at that point, but she was bred to some cheap stallions, because that is all I could really afford.

In the new SIM, Unbridled's Song has been primarily dirt miler. Depending on the dam, maybe a tad farther, maybe a tad shorter. Anthem was a brilliant miler, whose new SIM offspring are primarily dirt sprinter/milers. If I had owned the mare, I would have raced her at one mile with lasix, figure 8 and a tongue tie. Whether that would have made a difference, who knows, as she has a somewhat surface confused past on her dam's side. I do like her Mighty Big yearling (his first crop has been doing really well at 7 furlongs and a mile, even though he won the Derby), and I'm interested to see how he pans out. The 3yo seems surface confused to me, and Giacomos typically want more than 1 1/16 miles, so her 2yo has the opportunity to improve, although I'm not sure, distance-wise, if he was the best fit for this mare.

So, I definitely recommend going dirt miler (or long sprinter, meaning a horse who did his best at 7 furlongs, rather than six) with the sire, as you'll continue to push everything that isn't dirt miler back another generation. There's a really good discussion in the breeding forum on dirt milers, which can help to give you some ideas. Inbreeding is more a personal choice, although the closer up it is, the more fragile the horse can be, which makes it tougher on a new player who is still figuring out how much time between races? do I need a workout? etc. Farther back, like 3 x 4, that's less of a problem.

I guess, before I can really suggest anyone, rather than making these general pointers, what is your price range?

Lisa Strummer · Post by **Lisa Strummer** » 17 years ago

Laura F. wrote: At least, if you're going to try breeding, you're not spending a ton, and you're asking for advice, so it isn't a bad way to go.

Way back when, I was a poor, new SIM player, and I actually owned Hip Hop at one point. The mare had more turf influences at that point, but she was bred to some cheap stallions, because that is all I could really afford.

In the new SIM, Unbridled's Song has been primarily dirt miler. Depending on the dam, maybe a tad farther, maybe a tad shorter. Anthem was a brilliant miler, whose new SIM offspring are primarily dirt sprinter/milers. If I had owned the mare, I would have raced her at one mile with lasix, figure 8 and a tongue tie. Whether that would have made a difference, who knows, as she has a somewhat surface confused past on her dam's side. I do like her Mighty Big yearling (his first crop has been doing really well at 7 furlongs and a mile, even though he won the Derby), and I'm interested to see how he pans out. The 3yo seems surface confused to me, and Giacomos typically want more than 1 1/16 miles, so her 2yo has the opportunity to improve, although I'm not sure, distance-wise, if he was the best fit for this mare.

So, I definitely recommend going dirt miler (or long sprinter, meaning a horse who did his best at 7 furlongs, rather than six) with the sire, as you'll continue to push everything that isn't dirt miler back another generation. There's a really good discussion in the breeding forum on dirt milers, which can help to give you some ideas. Inbreeding is more a personal choice, although the closer up it is, the more fragile the horse can be, which makes it tougher on a new player who is still figuring out how much time between races? do I need a workout? etc. Farther back, like 3 x 4, that's less of a problem.

I guess, before I can really suggest anyone, rather than making these general pointers, what is your price range?

Well, it depends on a few things, I have been a little too eager to be involved in the game and have bought alot of horses (cheap ones though), so I can't get too crazy with a stud fee (also why I may just hold off until I have a little more cash flow). But I have quite a few horses in Friday and a few next week that are placed reasonably well, so hopefully I'll pick up a check or two, so I think my limit would be about $15,000.
I've done some research and there are not too many Anthem mares that have racing age foals, but of the few the most successful have been by Successful Appeal, Tribal Rule (who I really like), Inspired Fate to name a few. I do have some game points but I don't think she is worth spending those on to breed. It's hard to figure out a mare that didn't race much (her family too)that's why I'm asking for opinions..

Laura Ferguson · Post by **Laura Ferguson** » 17 years ago

That helps!

One thing to remember when doing searches by dam-sire (like Anthem), is that you also have to keep in mind the mare and that mare's family. This is sort of like the discussion I had in the "He Gave Me You" thread in this forum. If the mare is dirt sprinter, and her mom is dirt sprinter, than crossing that Anthem mare with a dirt sprinter stallion makes more sense. If a second Anthem mare is a dirt miler and her mom is a dirt miler, a better fit for the second Anthem mare would be a dirt miler stallion. A dirt sprinter stallion isn't necessarily a bad fit for the second Anthem mare, but the better fit is probably the dirt miler.

That said, I think you've come up with a pretty good list of stallions that fit your price range. I really like Strongerable - I'm just not sure that I'd send this mare to him, because Strongerable and Anthem have such similar bloodlines. I think my top choice off of your list would probably be Tribal Rule. I'd also toss Yume Senshi out there who is also in your price range. While a bit psychotic on the track, his first crop is doing pretty well at the 7 furlong/mile distance.

I don't think it is a bad idea to wait - other people may have opinions to post, and that's always a good thing. Good luck!

Laura

Lisa Strummer · Post by **Lisa Strummer** » 17 years ago

Thanks Laura! I forgot to mention Yume Senshi I like him too. I'm just gonna keep looking, see if anyone else has anything to add and go from there. I have til Sep 15 to decide if I'm gonna wait til next year, but I want to be prepared, you know?

Mallory Claire · Post by **Mallory Claire** » 17 years ago

I'm going to throw Successinthecity out there for this mare. He's unproven, but he was a nice runner and ended up being able to stretch to a mile towards the end of his career. His female family is impeccable.

Anthem may end up crossing quite nicely with him, for a few reasons. First, you've got the Symbol x Deputy Minister cross in there, which has worked so nicely for Ghostzapper. On top, American Baby is one of my favorite new sires, and he is by Symbol and comes from the same female family. Crossing Anthem (by Symbol) with the same female family would give you something similar; American Baby was also wound up a talented miler. Successinthecity is slightly out of your price range, but if you wait a bit, you might be able to scrape together the extra money. Might be worth it.

Good luck!

Gary Cooper · Post by **Gary Cooper** » 17 years ago

Yume Senshi bred with a sprint/miler broadmare will have no problem with a mile on the track. It is the best bargin out there. But...JMO !

Matty Dubs · Post by **Matty Dubs** » 17 years ago

I'm an advocate for Tribal Rule.

Then again, I'm a fellow new player...so I don't know how much that means, haha.

Can't go wrong listening to Laura or Mallory though. Both are very successful breeders. Gary and myself are just wildcards...and all the two of us have done is support things that wiser breeders have said, haha.

Overall point of this post? Probably none. Just becoming more and more of a fan of Tribal Rule as I continue to look at him as an option.

Lisa Strummer · Post by **Lisa Strummer** » 17 years ago

MalloryGuesnon wrote: I'm going to throw Successinthecity out there for this mare. He's unproven, but he was a nice runner and ended up being able to stretch to a mile towards the end of his career. His female family is impeccable.

Anthem may end up crossing quite nicely with him, for a few reasons. First, you've got the Symbol x Deputy Minister cross in there, which has worked so nicely for Ghostzapper. On top, American Baby is one of my favorite new sires, and he is by Symbol and comes from the same female family. Crossing Anthem (by Symbol) with the same female family would give you something similar; American Baby was also wound up a talented miler. Successinthecity is slightly out of your price range, but if you wait a bit, you might be able to scrape together the extra money. Might be worth it.

Good luck!

Oh, I LOVE Successinthecity with this mare, But I'll have to wait and see how my money holds out this year. But I hope to have enough next year to try that match out. Now, I'm looking for a less expensive sire, that will hopefully improve the mare a bit, I think she could throw something decent, if I work at it...

Lisa Strummer · Post by **Lisa Strummer** » 17 years ago

Hmmmmm, I did better than expected this week, if I pick up a few more checks before the year ends I may go outside my budget and go with Successinthecity after all...We'll see.