2yos

[Cleo Patra]

Well I had this surprise debut last night! She was a late bloomer stakes but her female line has given me a handful of late bloomer freaks.

Update: She is still a late bloomer stakes

Night Shivers - 2yo Filly - Mace x Nightmares by James Dean

Talent check after her second start. The jump occurs at post time of their 2nd start so we can’t see the improvement until after 2nd start.

She isn't in my barn right now so can't check but I could swear Sea Ghost's improvement was visible in her gallop immediately after first race I'll see if perhaps Nini can confirm or deny

I’ve never had one improve to confirm it, but I ask the Steward every second year when I forget the conditions

[Shannon Hunt]

Coming back with an armful of screenshots, I think the conclusion to be drawn is that "the gallop comment will show the change once Mary Weather has seen the unexpectedly good track performance and reevaluated her stance".

Sea Ghost was an allowance bloomer, debuted with a 91, I galloped her immediately after the race, Mary Weather backpedaled and said "oh no yeah totally a freak bloomer". This is the kind I'd call a first-race improver, it required entering a race but it was evident on debut and Mary was immediately able to change her evaluation.


Flamewild, on the other hand, was allowance peak, ran like a garbage can on legs in his first race, I thought nothing of it. Ran him again, 91 SF. Alright, Mary, what do we have to say about this? Ah, of course, stakes peak, she knew it all along. This is the kind I'd call a second-race improver - the first race put the bullet in the chamber, but he didn't actually fire until the second race.


Admittedly now that I look at it, I realize I didn't gallop him between the races, so I can't disprove that the gallop change wasn't visible after the first race. But I'm pretty sure Mary needs a result to look at before she can make a new call on gallop; she wouldn't be able to guess after his 55 SF debut that he's stakes, she's got nothing compelling to go on. But if the improvement occurs in the first race, Mary will be able to tell you immediately, like she did with Sea Ghost.

All this to say that if Nena's horse isn't showing a comment change after the first race, the high debut SF isn't due to jumping in ability in her first start; she's just a really zippy stakes (which is very cool, being so fast and still having the room to grow) (unless, of course, a horse can improve but still remain within its own comment range - either way, still a zippy stakes, not a jump to freak. If she goes even faster in the second start, def check for a freak comment then, in case of a second-start improvement).

[The Steward]

(unless, of course, a horse can improve but still remain within its own comment range

100% absolutely. I saw 2 of these last week without actually looking for them. More common than a multi level jump for sure, and probably why people think this isn't really a thing.

[Tim Matthews]

Well I had this surprise debut last night! She was a late bloomer stakes but her female line has given me a handful of late bloomer freaks.

Update: She is still a late bloomer stakes

Night Shivers - 2yo Filly - Mace x Nightmares by James Dean

Talent check after her second start. The jump occurs at post time of their 2nd start so we can’t see the improvement until after 2nd start.

I am confused again. Based on this post, the ONLY times a gallop comment can change are week 1, week 9, and after first start (and many have observed the comment jump immediately after the first start).

You'll see in the thread that I asked a follow up about this exact situation. The answer I got seems to contradict the information you've been given. Would love final clarification on this!